Ripoff - Marriott Vacation Club Destinations Program - New Point System

It seems that some are waiting for the Dest Pts program to fail. I also know that some did not enroll their legacy weeks in the new program. Could it be that the ones waiting for failure are the same ones who rejected enrollment of their weeks?

I enrolled our weeks at the inception of Destinations, have experienced it, and have been happy with the result - even two years later. I'm not complaining.

I waited until the last minute to enroll as I wanted to use those bonus points as late as I could.

I believe that people whose properties give them a substantial amount of points if they have even one week should join. The flexibility is something that they never know they might need. Sometimes you just may not be able to get to Hawaii, California or Europe for whatever reason.

Those who are "haters" can just keep on "hatin" because I know that many people that were reluctant to join on TUG are finding it not to be so bad.

The point system is great. I am finding that the flexibility gives me the opportunity to do much more than I could do before. I have 3 weeks and found that I was banking at least one and usually two every year, or trading them for rewards points. The destination program allows me to go when I want and usually where I want. Maybe I don't always get the value, but for me the trade off is well worth it.

My husband and I owned at 4 different Marriott Vacation Club properties. We've enjoyed over 24 years of incredible vacation opportunities including world-wide travel to destinations we never even imagined going to. Three years ago we gifted 2 of our 4 weeks to two of our daughters and their husbands, wanting to give them the same "vacations for life" opportunities that we had. Then, along comes the new Destinations Club program. We refuse to join; but one daughter and her husband attended a presentation (7/10) in Orlando and were talked into joining AND purchasing 1000 Trust points since the 1975 points they get with Cypress Harbour ownership won't do much for them. Now, 2 years later, they realize they made a huge mistake by buying trust points. They can't afford the monthly payments plus maintenance fees, their dreams of finally getting to Hawaii haven't materialized because they still don't have enough points, joining DC has made their ownership far more complicated, and they find that exchanging thru Interval the "old-fashioned" way with the week we gave them works best for them.

DOES ANYONE KNOW HOW TO SELL/MARKET 1000 TRUST POINTS FOR SALE? And, if so, at how much per point? They paid a little over $10,000 (points, closing fees, etc.) and still owe about $7000.

If anyone can lead me in the right direction to help them out, it would be most appreciated. THANK YOU.

Susan in Arizona

Hello Susan,

I am sorry that your family is in this situation. I will tell you that normally it is very difficult to sell any timshare when it is not already paid for. I am not saying it's impossible, but almost impossible. The reality is that they may have to end up paying it off and then try to sell.

I am sorry about this situation. Further, I challenge Vacation Club to come up with a reasonable way to help these folks out.

Resale of Points - I suggest that you start by calling Marriott-Resales at 866 682 4547. I doubt that they will buy them back but they should be able to provide information regarding your options. Ask about transfers, transfer costs, etc. I hope that one option might be to add another family member to the ownership and to eventually transfer them within the family. It is very likely that a significant loss will result from any sale.

One needs to think about the best way to transfer timeshare interests to family members. This includes finding a way to keep the portfolio intact so that the benefits of multiple ownerships survive. For example, wouldn't it be better to keep the multiple ownerships in one basket and to then allow heirs to take turns using them. Any comments from others on this topic would be very helpful.

Incidentally, I have advised my adult children that should they attend a sales presentation, they should not buy. They need to understand the program but they also should be aware of the other options available to meet their needs. "Renting what you need when you need it" is the best option to me. I speak from experience, we own 7 weeks and points.

Dennis, thank you so much for your response. I am just sick about all this. When I learned about the rollout of DC, I read everything I could about it and just couldn't see any value at all, at least to us, in joining. I had no idea my daughter and her husband planned to attend a presentation in Orlando or I would have cautioned them before going into it. They were new to the system as it was; and they were easily swayed by visions of 10,000 trust points opening the door to exotic destinations and also scaring them into believing the prime Marriott inventory in Interval would dry up as Marriott owners switched over to DC. I will try your suggestion and call Marriott Resales and see where it takes me.

For what it's worth, especially for anyone who reads this and is 'on the fence' about joining the new program, please just know that the scare tactics about owners not being able to exchange into Marriotts thru Interval as they had done in the past is just that, a scare tactic. Since January 2011, we have done 6 Interval exchanges using our Royal Palms week (had 2 weeks banked) and our Las Vegas week (lockout and 1 Bedroom Suite, so 2 trades from one week) plus 2 Accommodation Certificates for:

1 week at Marriott's Summit Watch - 2 BD/2 BATH 1 week at Marriott's Grand Chateau - 2 BD/2 BATH 1 week at Marriott's Ocean Pointe - 3 BD/3 BATH 1 week at Marriotts Newport Coast Villas - 2 BD/2 BATH 1 week at Marriotts Desert Springs Villas - 2 BD/2 BATH 1 week at The Royal Haciendas in Playa del Carment - 2 BD/2 BATH

There just is no reason for us to be in the new program.

Thanks again for your help and advice.

There are many reasons for deeded owners to join the destinations program. Especially if you have multiple weeks. You can still turn the weeks over to Interval and your fee to do so is 0 instead of 129 or whatever the fee now is to make a reservation. The 199 annual fee for multiple weeks is a money savor. However, having said the above I can't think of any reason to purchase NEW TRUST POINTs. The price is redicilious as are the mtce fees.

Susan,

If you feel it appropriate, you might share the response from Vacation Club to a buyback inquiry including what they offer. I suspect that they will tell you that they are not buying points back. If they do, prospective buyers are entitled to know this at the outset. I inquired about this two years ago and again since then and never received an appropriate answer. Marriott and Vacation Club should face up to this issue - especially after two years.

If disclosed to them, most potential buyers would probably walk away at the prospect of an immediate 50% or even 100% devaluation upon purchase of points.

Dennis

Susan,

When I first read your original post about having the four properties in Marriott, I immediately thought the same as Dennis which was that you should have all four in the points system. You would have good savings for everyone and added flexibiility. First, you would not have to pay for Interval International (II) membership. Secondly, you would not have to pay for Marriott exchanges, so if all of your four units were used by II in one year to stay at other Marriotts that would be $149 x 4 in savings. That's almost $600 in savings plus your membership fee of $89 for the year. That's nearly $700. I haven't even talked about if you decided to lock off because you and your husband would not need a two bedroom since it was just the two of you. That would be savings too. You and your kids would have the same benefits. You would get that saving without using ever having to elect using points.

However, the points option could be could be good if there is a substantial amount of points that can be attained from your properties. However, with only 1975 points for the Cypress Harbour there may not be enough points from all four properties that would give you real power in the system. When one gets over 12,000 points you get to make your reservations early with them being guaranteed upfront instead of waiting for II to tell you if you MAY get what you want.

Anyhow, I am not trying to sell you on it. I just wanted to share the thoughts that came to my mind. My advice is always look to maximize your membership. If one of your kids is in the points program, doesn't that apply to all four properties or did you actually change the deed over to them. If it is still in your name you may wish to think about it.

Susan,

I'm with Charles on keeping the vacation weeks & points in one basket and this is what we did - ours are all in a trust. I suspect you know the significant reservation advantages that come with multiple weeks. You might think about bringing the timeshares back together along with the recently acquired points. Check with Marriott about transferring "within the family" as I think this can be done. I suspect the recently acquired points are a near total loss - if you could sell them at all. However, the points are worth keeping (considering the probable total loss alternative) if you can bring this all together into one pool.

Dennis

Thanks to everyone who responds and offers suggestions. Here's a little more clarification that may help:

1. We actually deeded 2 of our 4 weeks to 2 of our daughter early in 2009, BEFORE knowing a new program was going to be introduced. What we have left is an EOY 2-Bedroom with lockout option at The Grand Chateau in Vegas and a 2-Bedroom at The Royal Palms in Orlando.

2. Since 1988, when we bought the first week, we've primarily done Marriott Rewards trips using points for hotel/air packages. We always took points for 3 of the weeks and used the 4th for a family trip or giving to our kids to use. The promises of "vacations for life" really did come true for us as we've been just about everywhere on points: Australia, Greece, Egypt, China, Hong Kong, Brazil, Argentina, all over Europe, to many different islands, 3 cruises, etc.). Everyone knew me as Marriott's biggest fan! I couldn't say enough good stuff about the program.

3. Along comes the new program. If you read what I said above about one of our daughters and her husband going to their first ever "presentation" a little over a year after taking ownership of one of our weeks -- and then being talked into purchasing 1000 trust points because their Cypress Harbour week didn't have much trading value as DC points alone -- maybe you'll understand why I am turned off about the program. The kids were just beginning to understand the Marriott program as new owners and were easily swayed into believing they'd never be able to go anywhere else but Orlando unless they purchased trust points, or something to that effect. I don't have a problem with them joining DC to save fees, but I do have a major problem with how pressure is put on someone who was just given a gift (the week from us) and basically being told they needed to purchase points for it to do anything for them. Believe me, 1000 points did nothing but complicate their ownership more and put them in debt!

4. So, when we went to our very own presentation later in 2010, it is very true that I went into it with lots of negative thoughts. Perhaps I did not have an open mind at all and did not want to give the salesperson the satisfaction of talking us into this program like they had done with her daughter. The thing is that we almost joined DC just for the fee thing; but opted against it after hearing some of the comments that were made to various points I had brought up. For example, when I asked how the using DC points could possibly be an improvement over the fantastic II exchanges we've enjoyed in the past (i.e., exchanging a LV lockout for a 2 bedroom at Newport Coast or exchanging the lockout for a 2 bedroom oceanfront Royal property in Playa del Carmen), we were told that "for everyone like us who takes advantage of Interval's loopholes, others suffer from their system." I challenged him by saying that using the lockout as we had done was initially one of the selling points that got us to buy that property in the first place. I gave numerous examples of statements/reasons we'd been given for becoming Marriott owners in the past, only to have those same reasons for buying back then now being major negatives. I could go on and on, but will stop here. Suffice it to say we were so turned off by the new sales approach that we wanted nothing to do with joining DC. It may be right for lots of people, especially those with multiple weeks in high-demand places. It isn't right for us.

5. When we have exchanged thru Interval in the past, we always got what we wanted when we wanted it. We are flexible, so I know that helps. Now that we're kind of dine with the world-wide travel, we've enjoyed taking another couple with us to other great destinations throughout the U.S.

That you Susan for sharing your story. I think many can benefit from this by avoiding some of the mistakes. 1. If possible, keep all the weeks in the same name. Once parents deed their weeks to various children, each has to have their own II membership or annual fees. In addition, you loose flexibility and reservation status. 2. If you join the Destination Points program it is my understanding that parents can pass their weeks to their children and these weeks can stay in the program. However, one chid can not pass their weeks to another child and keep those weeks in the program. (Nor can children pass the weeks to their parents and keep them in the program.) Thus, once Susan deeded her weeks to various children, this can't be put back together under one name without loosing benefits. 3. Purchasing points is extraordinary expensive with a low benefit. Better to purchase deeded weeks on the open market and use II to trade. Or rent. 4. The new Trust points can be sold in the open market just like deeded weeks. However, they will sell for a significant discount just like deeded property. In today's market you would be lucky to get 50% of your purchase price -- and most sales will likely be far less. 5 As long as you know the benefits and risks you can make an informed decision. Most who are selling Trust points do not talk about how to get rid of your purchase after you have it. Let's be clear. At some point eveyone who has deeded weeks or Trust points will wish to sell them. Marriott has no interest in purchasing Trust points as they already have too many. Marriott will purchase some deeded weeks in high demand locations in high demand seasons -- but will use their first right of refusal to purchase them at a low price. Once you purchase deeded weeks or Trust points the marketplace will determine the value. 6. If you sell deeded weeks and are in the Destination Points program, the person who purchases your week can not particiapte in this program. These weeks would have more value if this was not true. But Marriott has shown zero interest in maintaining the value of your puchase. Their only interest in selling -- and then being paid to manage the property.

I hope every owner will take the time to understand these points.

(I am a 9 week owner of Marriott timeshares all of which I purchased on the open Market prior to the introduction of the Destinationn Points program. I bought into the new program because the annal 199 fee is less then the all the per case fees and I gain flexiblity. I say this so you will know why I try to understand the details of both buying and selling my weeks.)

We own three weeks in the Marriott Time Share program. We have been to two presentations and considered buying into the Destination Club points. When investigating into the what we were told and what we were actually getting it didn't match. We were told that we could use the DC points with our time share points to go to some of the DC locations. NOT TRUE. The points we would buy at about $11,000. + wouldn't do anything for us because we CAN NOT use them with our time share points. Marriott has their fist in our pockets and not holding up to what we were sold when we bought into the time share program. We are sorely disappointed in Marriott.

What are time share points? I am only familiar with Destination Club points and Marriott Rewards points? So what are time share points?

to bernettad3 Here are the categories. - Trust points. (The new points that you have to purchase.). - Distination Points (The new program from trading in deeded weeks). - Rewards points. (Often called the hotel program. Been around for a long time.)

While you can't combine Trust Points and Destination Point in one bin you can use them for the same vacation by getting some days under one program and some days under another.

Given the above I did not understand the point you were making.

Hi, For those of you that have purchased weeks from other owners, did you use redweek or do it some other way. Any advise or anything to be aware of?? Thanks! Tracey

Two months ago I purchased a resale for Marriott's Manor Club on eBay - paid less than $100. I already owned three other weeks bought at retail from Marriott years ago and have a regular pattern of use with those that I'm happy with, but thought if I could pick up an inexpensive two-bedroom resale, I could use that to lock off and turn into two weeks that I could trade with Interval. There are many times that I cannot plan in advance and so trading within 60 days of travel allows one to see all of Interval's available inventory for that period.

The sale was completed and the deed transferred into my name within about 5 to 6 weeks. Last week I was able to trade the studio portion of the lock off for a two bedroom Ko Olina week. There have also been some good opportunities for the one-bedroom portion of my lock off as well, but I am not yet ready to make that trade.

The curious thing to me, however, has been that I have seen almost no owner inventory from which to pick. I know it's summer, but in the past you always had at least a few cancellations that appeared, albeit briefly, in the inventory. Understand that I check frequently during the day and especially on weekends. What I have found, for some reason, is that Marriott themselves has deposited several weeks - at both Ko Olina (all sizes), and Maui Beach Club (1bedrooms). As of last night, there were still rooms available at both these properties from mid September on.

BTW, if you are going to consider purchases through eBay, be very careful when checking out the vendors. There is one in particular that seems to have a good deal of positive feedback, however, when you look at that feedback, it is primarily for products other than timeshare. Most of their timeshare feedback is actually negative. Caveat emptor!

To the person who asked about the risk of purchasing a timeshare on ebay -- Regarding purchasing timeshares from those advertized on redweek.com or ebay or wherever. The risk is about zero -- and you don't have to worry about the seller -- AS LONG AS YOU USE A REPUTABLE TITLE COMPANY TO HANDLE THE CLOSE. (Like Chicago Title or American Title) You and the seller need to sign a letter contract that spells out the timeshare, the season, the price, and who is to get the current week, who is to pay for the mtce fee, and who is paying for the closing costs. Each turns over a signed document to the title company and the buyer sends the agreed upon deposit. The title company then cheks to makes sure the seller is the actual owner, that dues have been paid etc. Once everything is in order the title company will request the seller to send the rest of the payment and they will close the sale. (Similar process to selling a house.) The key point of using a reputable title company to handle the closing is so you as a buyer don't have to be concerned about the trustworthyness of the buyer. Hope this helps.

I signed up with the Destination Program but have not confirmed yet. Am still puzzled by this program. Perhaps you contact can provide the answers to my problem. Thanks Ceferinoa