Manhattan Club Lawsuit

Forum: The Manhattan Club

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Message Author

By Chris V.

Manhattan Club Lawsuit

this is in response to my original request to ms kallio regarding the number of paid subscribers redweek.com "the manhattan club lawsuit" forum from jan 1 through june of 2019.

you indicate that, if i read it correctly, there are......................."YTD, looks like ~ 38k unique page views. And there have been 598 unique posters to this thread."

that's 598 paid subscribers, ytd, correct? if not, please indicate the actual modification.

maurice wrote:
> I would be grateful if RedWeek could provide this info

Hey, Nathan. Sure, we can try to get you some of those stats.

This thread, "Manhattan Club Lawsuit," has had ~ 900k page views (not unique users). Looks like there are ~ 5,600 messages.

YTD, looks like ~ 38k unique page views. And there have been 598 unique posters to this thread.

Last edit by chrisv126 on Jun 07, 2019 02:02 PM.

Avatar for Chris V. Chris V.

3 months ago
Jun 07, 2019

By Nathan Z.

Thank you Maurice, that’s a great start! I see the 5600 posts on the list of MC forums, but I don’t understand why the year to date figures are unique but the other figures, which I assume are totals, are not. Even that way, the YTD numbers for 5 months , which you say are unique, are more than double MC ownership. Very curious! Thanks so much for looking into this! And thank Kylie as well for her role in your research!

Last edit by nathanz2 on Jun 07, 2019 02:18 PM.

Avatar for Nathan Z. Nathan Z.

3 months ago
Jun 07, 2019

By Maurice A.
RedWeek.com Team

> that's 598 paid subscribers, ytd, correct? if not, please indicate the actual modification.

No, sorry. 598 total posters to this this thread total. YTD, there's only be 95 posters.

> Even that way, the YTD numbers for 5 months , which you say are unique, are more than double MC ownership. Very curious!

So you're trying to get an idea of what percentage of Manhattan Club owners have viewed this thread?

The data is coming from disparate sources, so some of the measures are fuzzy. Many people read the threads anonymously, so all we really have is an IP address.

There's also this other thread in the resort forum: https://www.redweek.com/forums/messages?thread_id=20127

That one has had seven unique posters YTD. 80 posters total.

Last edit by maurice on Jun 07, 2019 02:37 PM.

Avatar for Maurice A. Maurice A.
RedWeek.com Team

3 months ago
Jun 07, 2019

By Nathan Z.

Thank you again Maurice. The data seems clear to me. Most folks who visit here are transactionallly oriented. They come and they go. Few stick around. Only the hard core post much, and they (we) squabble a lot. The tone of the interchange probably makes it uncomfortable for a lot of people to join in. It may be a public service, but probably not conducive to a lot of business for RedWeek. Not enormously helpful for adding owners outside the core group of posters either. Thanks again for hosting and sharing these stats.

Last edit by nathanz2 on Jun 08, 2019 10:48 AM.

Avatar for Nathan Z. Nathan Z.

3 months ago
Jun 08, 2019

By Gary P.

Just received a letter from the Manhattan club that if I don’t pay my maintenance fee ASAP I will be charged an additional amount of$453 on top of the escalating yearly Maintanence of$3743. They have becomes whores especially when my contract starts on 8/1. Worst investment I ever made!!!! Thinking about not paying but it will only increase everyone else’s rate. How do we get out of this horrible investment?

Avatar for Gary P. Gary P.

3 months ago
Jun 09, 2019

By Thomas M.

My Mom stopped paying last year. She doesn't use it and just wants out. She is now considering joining the Zimmerman suit.

Regarding the foreclosure comment above, just based on the posts here, I thought that 2015 case that was mentioned was about BG foreclosing on timeshare owners, which was deemed illegal. Is that not correct??

thomasb840 wrote:
Hello. My wife and I stopped paying maintenance fees last year. So far so good. Anyone else?

Avatar for Thomas M. Thomas M.

3 months ago
Jun 09, 2019

By Joy K.

hello garyp151 and all other posters/frustrated owners (but no friendly "hello" to the TMC plants reading the posts):

There is a clear-cut way out, though laborious, time consuming, and requiring a disciplined approach. You need to do research, access the AG documents, and go to the courthouse often at 111 Centre Street, NY. Start by going to the court website and downloading the self-help guide on bring a case as your own lawyer (called PRO SE), and you can go to the court house for free consultation help and guidance in prosecuting your case.

Get your facts and paperwork together. Develop your argument for breach of contract (up to $25,000); add up your dollars lost on the purchase of the contract and its execution, broken promises made at point of sale, and evidence of how YOU'VE been denied access to your purchased services (access to TMC). Get the AG documents for INDEX 451536/2014 (court case), documents NYSCEF DOC. NO. 138, 329, 411 and the Assurance of Discontinuance, 17-149 as some of your evidence; it's freely available on the Court website.

Go to the Courthouse and file a COMPLAINT AND SUMMONS with the back up evidence to send with the summons, and pay the court clerk CASH (about $47 or so). Take your summons and have them served. You can ask the Sheriff at 66 John Street (2nd floor?), NY to serve the SUMMONS and pay them $86 by CHECK or MONEY ORDER (no cash), but be aware that the Sheriff will mail you the service documents which you have to file with the court at 111 Centre St. If you live out of town, it would be easier to pay a process server who will file the papers with the court for a fee.

You have to provide the Sheriff the address of service, and you can try serving at the address 200 W. 56th Street, NY 10019, or their O &T Park's Articles of Incorporation give ALLAN STARR, ESQ., STARR ASSOCIATES LLP, 245 FIFTH AVENUE, SUITE 1102, NEW YORK, NEW YORK, 10016 as the registered agent of service. When the papers are filed, I think you set up your first hearing date at the Court.

The defendants (Ian Bruce Eichner and whomever is on your sales/deed, like O Park, T Park or whomever) have to ANSWER you within a few weeks, and they'll basically say, not us, we didn't do it, you're the one at fault for buying it or something to that effect. You'll probably get some lawyer from Romer Debbas LLC as their current, contracted legal representatives.

Your next step is to serve INTERROGATORIES as part of Discovery. Keep your questions straightforward, simple, short answers. Avoid "all, every" type questions, no fishing expedition questions. Just ask for verification of the facts of your being denied access, incidences or timelines of their breach of contract with YOU, etc. You're not trying to convict them for criminal behavior or being frauds; you're trying to get your money back and get out of the contract. Keep it clean and cool.

They'll probably RESPOND to your discovery demands by basically saying irrelevant, doesn't address the issues, fatally flawed argument, etc. You'll have to file a NOTICE OF A MOTION TO COMPEL, and you take the MOTION to the judge to present why you need them to answer your questions/INTERROGATORIES to argue your case. You can look up all of these procedures online, get explanations and examples; be as specific as you can to New York Civil Courts.

Currently, the TMC principals are dealing with 4 civil suits and 2 tax suits. The internet is an awesome, incredible resource to learn the basics of being your own lawyer.

p. s. I would pay my maintenance fees to avoid them having anything over me for not holding up my end of the contract. I think the Court would look more favorably on me if I'm not in arrears.

Avatar for Joy K. Joy K.

3 months ago
Jun 09, 2019

By Nathan Z.

Hello Thomas M.,

I'm not an attorney, but I read for detail. The quote you refer to says that BG agreed to stop reporting timeshares as foreclosed when they were only in arrears but had not yet gone through a legal foreclosure action. It said nothing about preventing BG from bringing foreclosure actions. BG probably went the (dubious) reporting route because it is far less expensive than actually bringing a foreclosure action and avoids the need to resell the unit in a dropping market while they still have a paying owner.

Since Joy sounds like an attorney perhaps she will weigh in.

Last edit by nathanz2 on Jun 10, 2019 03:03 AM.

Avatar for Nathan Z. Nathan Z.

3 months ago
Jun 09, 2019

By Gary P.

It sounds like u are going through the process. Who has time for all that and will the outcome be pisitive?

Avatar for Gary P. Gary P.

3 months ago
Jun 09, 2019

By William M.

What a great message Joy K. If I understood you correctly, in order to succeed you must prove you were denied use of your time. I wonder how that would work out if you attempted to book with little notice. How much lead time would be considered reasonable?

Last edit by phyl21 on Jun 10, 2019 08:11 AM.

Avatar for William M. William M.

3 months ago
Jun 10, 2019

By Steven W

Joy your message is very thorough and accurate....BUT as I have now posted 2-3 times on this website, the easiest way to get out is to simply do a deed of gift, transferring the timeshare to NY State, NY City, the MC TimeshareOwners Club, the Orange/Haired narcissistic President, your disliked next door neighbor or whoever else you chose. Deliver the deed by mail,. Unless it is promptly rejected as a gift by returning it to you, CONGRATS TO THE NEW OWNER! Send a letter to whoever sends the maintenance bills as to the change of ownership. Done. Alternative is to bequeath it by your Will.

joyk42 wrote:
hello garyp151 and all other posters/frustrated owners (but no friendly "hello" to the TMC plants reading the posts):

There is a clear-cut way out, though laborious, time consuming, and requiring a disciplined approach. You need to do research, access the AG documents, and go to the courthouse often at 111 Centre Street, NY. Start by going to the court website and downloading the self-help guide on bring a case as your own lawyer (called PRO SE), and you can go to the court house for free consultation help and guidance in prosecuting your case.

Get your facts and paperwork together. Develop your argument for breach of contract (up to $25,000); add up your dollars lost on the purchase of the contract and its execution, broken promises made at point of sale, and evidence of how YOU'VE been denied access to your purchased services (access to TMC). Get the AG documents for INDEX 451536/2014 (court case), documents NYSCEF DOC. NO. 138, 329, 411 and the Assurance of Discontinuance, 17-149 as some of your evidence; it's freely available on the Court website.

Go to the Courthouse and file a COMPLAINT AND SUMMONS with the back up evidence to send with the summons, and pay the court clerk CASH (about $47 or so). Take your summons and have them served. You can ask the Sheriff at 66 John Street (2nd floor?), NY to serve the SUMMONS and pay them $86 by CHECK or MONEY ORDER (no cash), but be aware that the Sheriff will mail you the service documents which you have to file with the court at 111 Centre St. If you live out of town, it would be easier to pay a process server who will file the papers with the court for a fee.

You have to provide the Sheriff the address of service, and you can try serving at the address 200 W. 56th Street, NY 10019, or their O &T Park's Articles of Incorporation give ALLAN STARR, ESQ., STARR ASSOCIATES LLP, 245 FIFTH AVENUE, SUITE 1102, NEW YORK, NEW YORK, 10016 as the registered agent of service. When the papers are filed, I think you set up your first hearing date at the Court.

The defendants (Ian Bruce Eichner and whomever is on your sales/deed, like O Park, T Park or whomever) have to ANSWER you within a few weeks, and they'll basically say, not us, we didn't do it, you're the one at fault for buying it or something to that effect. You'll probably get some lawyer from Romer Debbas LLC as their current, contracted legal representatives.

Your next step is to serve INTERROGATORIES as part of Discovery. Keep your questions straightforward, simple, short answers. Avoid "all, every" type questions, no fishing expedition questions. Just ask for verification of the facts of your being denied access, incidences or timelines of their breach of contract with YOU, etc. You're not trying to convict them for criminal behavior or being frauds; you're trying to get your money back and get out of the contract. Keep it clean and cool.

They'll probably RESPOND to your discovery demands by basically saying irrelevant, doesn't address the issues, fatally flawed argument, etc. You'll have to file a NOTICE OF A MOTION TO COMPEL, and you take the MOTION to the judge to present why you need them to answer your questions/INTERROGATORIES to argue your case. You can look up all of these procedures online, get explanations and examples; be as specific as you can to New York Civil Courts.

Currently, the TMC principals are dealing with 4 civil suits and 2 tax suits. The internet is an awesome, incredible resource to learn the basics of being your own lawyer.

p. s. I would pay my maintenance fees to avoid them having anything over me for not holding up my end of the contract. I think the Court would look more favorably on me if I'm not in arrears.

Avatar for Steven W Steven W

3 months ago
Jun 10, 2019

By Thomas M.

nathanz2 wrote:
Hello Thomas M.,

I'm not an attorney, but I read for detail. The quote you refer to says that BG agreed to stop reporting timeshares as foreclosed when they were only in arrears but had not yet gone through a legal foreclosure action. It said nothing about preventing BG from bringing foreclosure actions. BG probably went the (dubious) reporting route because it is far less expensive than actually bringing a foreclosure action and avoids the need to resell the unit in a dropping market while they still have a paying owner.

Since Joy sounds like an attorney perhaps she will weigh in.

Thanks for the clarification.

Avatar for Thomas M. Thomas M.

3 months ago
Jun 10, 2019

By Richard Q.

Anybody with comments/experience with "Wesley Financial"-an outfit that advertises a guarantees they'll get you out of time shares? They tell me they are handling TMC/BlueGreen.You pay them upfront fee,which you'll get back if they don't get you out.They'll pursue getting money,which they'll take 30% of.Based on their website,they are OK with Better Business Bureau,AARP,etc.

Avatar for Richard Q. Richard Q.

3 months ago
Jun 13, 2019

By Lena P.

I don’t trust any companies that require money up front. While their own website says they are ok with BBB, AARP, etc, I recommend you check out the actual BBB website and others. Most of these timeshare release companies are not reputable.

Avatar for Lena P. Lena P.

3 months ago
Jun 13, 2019

By Robert M.

Richard, I was tempted to try Wesley, but when I heard the cost up front was nearly $10,000. I backed away. I'm hoping the "deed give back scheme will eventually work for us. Bob M

Avatar for Robert M. Robert M.

3 months ago
Jun 13, 2019

By Dick H.

I contacted the Wesley people about helping me out of TMC. They wanted an upfront fee of $8,750.00 which was way beyond my means and I declined their assistance. While they might try to recover part of my $33,000, there were, of course, no “guarantees” of help here. If, after three years (I believe), they are not able to extricate us from our TMC contract, they will refund my up front fee of $8,750.00. This, of course, assumes they are still in business at that point.

Avatar for Dick H. Dick H.

3 months ago
Jun 13, 2019

By Cheryl M.

I was wondering about Wesley. Thanks for the information.

Avatar for Cheryl M. Cheryl M.

3 months ago
Jun 13, 2019

By Sue O.

just my two cents but i looked a Timeshare Exit team two years ago, and even met personally with them - probably similar to Wesley. Do not give any money up front to a company like this - I think you would be better off sending the relatively nominal check(or credit card payment) to the Zimmerman Law Group along with many of us to try and fight this in court. I can't give you any guarantees either but I think it's a better option. I have met Jean Marc Zimmerman and feel he really is trying to help us.

Avatar for Sue O. Sue O.

3 months ago
Jun 15, 2019

By Nikki M.

I stopped paying this year and also just had a letter this week with an additional $340 for not paying. I’m not paying and have joined zimmerman team.

Avatar for Nikki M. Nikki M.

3 months ago
Jun 15, 2019

By Julie Osikoya D.

Nikkim91 What is the cost to join Zimmerman team? I have also stopped paying the maintenance fee this year.

Avatar for Julie Osikoya D. Julie Osikoya D.

3 months ago
Jun 17, 2019

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