Advance Fee Timeshare Resale Company Training Material

I am posting material below that comes directly from TimeshareMLS.org. It's a few selections from their training material. This material represents various rebuttals to any objections a potential scam victim may have. To anyone that has dealt with timesharemls.org or any other advance fee resale company this will be all too familiar.

I am posting this material directly as it is distributed by CHL Marketing (timesharemls.org) so it does contain spelling and punctuation errors.

Below is a few rebuttals for when a potential scam victim says they have gone through an advance fee resale company before and got absolutely no results from it:

I Have Been Burnt Before

O.K. I am not going to were a black eye for what they didn’t do.

I am sorry, but that was in the past and we are here for today and the future.

Great if they sell it before we do I will give you all your money back!

Great this will give you double exposure. TMLS provides a gateway to millions of customers and all of the real estate brokers such as Century 21, GMAC, and Remax via the internet and through other medias of adverting.

Well great you kind of know what it takes but unfortunately was lead down the wrong path. TMLS also works with the Arnold Palmer Women and Children's Foundation. The Hospital is located here in Orlando Florida. Since 1989, the Arnold Palmer Hospital for Children & Women has been healing women and children from Central Florida and around the world with care, compassion and leading edge medical care. A portion of the companys proceeds will be donated to their foundation.

JUST LET ME DO MY JOB!!!!!! Have a nice Day!!!

Below is the response given to a potential victim when they are told timesharemls.org's (CHL Marketing, Inc.) BBB Report isn't a very good one:

Better Business Bureau Rebuttal

We are currently disputing the BBB report through our legal department. They did mention that we are disputing the report on their recording, didn’t they? They didn’t? (Act Surprised). Well I’m really glad you called the BBB because we need to know that. I’ll have to immediately alert our legal department on that. Thanks for the heads up) Clients Name).

Believe me _________, we are not the only company that has had problems with the BBB’s unfair reporting practices. We used to be members. However, in 1997 when the Orlando BBB was issued a federal indictment for extortionary business practices, we withdrew our membership, they haven’t been too accommodating, to say the least.

You see the BBB membership charges the member merchant by the number of employees. We are a large company with many employees so we save thousands of dollars annually by not being a member. (And that money goes into the advertisements of your property) The BBB lose thousands of dollars annually. But I’m sure you can appreciate that everything has its. Price. So I would strongly urge you to take with a grain of salt, a report that essentially has no basis in fact.

In the few instances where we have had a minor complaint, we have addressed and resolved it immediately! And on the rare occasion when it does happen, it’s usually due to a seller who has an unrealistic idea of what their timeshare is worth. You see, as a “For Sale By Owner” Company, we can only suggest to the seller what they should be asking for their unit. We suggest prices that are less than what the resort is selling them for so the buyer can realize a savings. We cannot dictate to the seller what to ask for the unit and we cannot refuse to market their unit if they are a paying customer _______ there are enough obstacles you have to overcome in order to sell/rent your unit; so don’t let a “sour Grapes” BBB report become another one. Now which credit card are we using today?

The following addresses a few questions potential scam victims may have for the advance fee sales rep:

Things you could say to take control of the call.

I heard that from the other company too: Well I am not going to wear a black eye for what they did not do. Please understand my company Timeshare MLS is located here in Orlando Florida in the heart of all timeshares. We advertise timeshare at our discretion is in newspaper, billboards, monthly showcase and on the Internet search engines. TimeshareMLS.org .is the most looked at website for the timeshare resale market.

What separates you from other companies: Well I am glad you ask that question. What we do is we market to the every year vacationers and corporate companies who travel monthly or yearly to not only Orlando but all over the world. When a client calls or emails my company about purchasing a timeshare we get all their information and the information on what resort they want. When all that is done we will contact you the owner and let you know we have a potential buyer who is looking to buy your property. So what will happen now is you the owner will contact the resort and let them know you have a guest coming down for your week. When the resort hears this they are going to assume that you are sending an owner referral. So they will probably set them up for a 90 minutes tour and they will get to hear all the great benefits from the resort themselves.

Why do I have to give money up front: Well now that is a really good question and to put your mind at ease I will tell you we are a MLS advertising agency and to get your information in newspaper and on billboards it cost money and please understand me this stuff is not cheap my company has to pay theses newspapers and billboards and the Internet weekly monthly fees now if you would like me to charge you on a monthly or weekly basis that would be fine but I don’t ask that of you I ask you for a little bit today to let me know you are serious about selling or renting your timeshare. Please understand also that your one time advertising fee is only good for 90 days if at the 90 day point your timeshare (and you can read this in the total agreement I will send out to you in the mail) is not sold or rented then my company has to continue to pay for the advertisement out of our own pocket until sold or rented . What is my guarantee: My guarantee is to get your timeshare in my inventory and at our discretion get it advertised until sold for you in 90 days. If your timeshare is not sold in 90 days I have to continue to pay for your advertisement fee out of my own company’s expense. Secondly if you or any other company sells your timeshare we will refund you every dime of your advertisement fee.

Next is the Advance Fee Resale Company justifying the $999 fee for their advertising services. $999 is what they want but as you'll see in the next post this isn't written in stone:

What does 999 get me?

First thing it will get is your timeshare advertised until sold. The way we advertise at our discretion our information in magazines, newspapers, billboards, banners, and of course on the most looked at website www.timesharemls.org Secondly the way people buy timeshare is by taking a 90minute tour. Unfortunately we can’t give those tours. The only way we can sell these properties is to let the potential owner stay in the resort and enjoy the amenities as you did the day you bought. What will happen is when somebody contacts my customer service wanting to buy a timeshare they want to see it first. This is why we offer them the option to rent it before buying. My customer service dept. will contact you the owner and go over all the details about what the client wants. At that point it is still up to you to call the resort because it is still your timeshare. Let the resort know you are having a guest stay in your unit. Once the resort says they do have the room you call our customer service department. At that point we will put you the owner and the renter on the phone together to go over the method of payment and how it will get to you. While the renter is staying in your resort the resort themselves will set them up for a 90minute tour trying to sell them a timeshare at there high dollar price when the whole time the renter knows your property is the one they want to buy. Finally when you and the new owner decide on a selling price you contact our customer service department and we will contact the title company (Timeshare Closing Services Inc.) that will take care of the title search, estoppel letter and all closing documents needed to get your timeshare property sold. The buyer will pay all closing fees. Once all the paper work is signed and returned you will receive your cashiers check from the escrow account.

The following is the pricing chart that CHL Marketing, Inc. (Timesharemls.org, TimeshareFSBO.com, Timeshare ResalesUSA.com and soon to be Timeshare Resales GMAC.com) uses. As you can see, the service they sell isn't so valuable that it has to be a set fee, $999, $899 or even $799 period but it is flexible depending on what the sales rep can get out of a timeshare owner.

If the service had great value it doesn't make sense that one person can be sold the package at $799 but another can purchase at $399 for the exact same thing (albeit the exact same thing equates to $0 value for the timeshare owner).

It's apparent the value of their service isn't what is most important but the available credit limit on a timeshare owner's visa or mastercard is what's most important.

They always want to break down any dollar amount to small numbers to make it easier for the timeshare owner feel that $699 or $799 or whatever price is really a great value when you think about it (yeah right!)

Here is CHL Marketing's accetpable sale prices:

Break it down to the Ridiculous!!

999 = $11 a day for 90 days of advertisement 899 = $10 a day for 90 days of advertisement 799 = $9 a day for 90 days of advertisement 699 = $8 a day for 90 days of advertisement 599 = $ 7 a day for 90 days of advertisement 499 = $6 a day for 90 days of advertisement 399 = $5 a day for 90 days of advertisement

For anyone that is curious as to how I have TimeshareMLS.orgs's training material please refer back to my TimeshareMLS.org Advance Fee Resale Scam and this will explain why I have this.

garym172 wrote:

For anyone that is curious as to how I have TimeshareMLS.orgs's training material please refer back to my TimeshareMLS.org Advance Fee Resale Scam and this will explain why I have this.

Gary this would be a funny skit on Sat Night Live!

I love when someone ask a question that they have no answer in print,they then need to go ask the floor managers who will then stop buy and give you a dumb ass answer that almost sounds possible at that moment!

This stuff is funny if you enjoy playing the game but don't pay anything.

We walked in one place in Orlando just because we needed to get away from Disney for few hours and wanted to get in air conditioning.

We went in and told them we owned at Marriott in Maui and were thinking of selling it and buying in Orlando.

This man became our best friend within minutes and as many tell you he plays in a local band. He said we should come in and see his band and after asking what kind of music we like(Country) his band is country.

He then tells us we could buy top of the line in Orlando the top resort area in the world for families. Tells us many people sick of Hawaii and selling and buying in Orlando. We had trouble keeping straight face!

He then states he also owned there few years ago and made same move to Orlando! This guy looked like he was still paying payments on his first car that was ten years old!

My wife then says we are thinking of buying Disney and for next ten minutes we hear why not to buy Disney and buy better unit outside the Disney Resort and have better trade or rent value.

Disney gives to many discounts so renting hard to do and its to easy to trade into so top trades don't happened! We felt like we were dressed in farmers clothing and from Mayberry with Barney and Andy!

We then were told if we list our Marriott with him right then we will get a discount plus another discount on a purchase.

This guy was able to have answer to anything we pitched to him. After saying we needed to think about it and decide before going home he agreed the one time deal would still be here for us later and he came down $400 on the listing price. We gave him our hotel phone number and had about four messages left by him.

This was fun wasting his time while we took a break and sit in cool building for few minutes!

I know this was down right mean and we loved every second of it! LMAO

Way to go Phil.

I'm sure if you had told the guy you were originally from Mayberry by some miraculous coincidence he'd would have been born in a town 10 minutes away and talked about how much he loved the mountains of North Carolina. Or at the very least his wife would have been born and raised there.

The great thing about that is you and your wife had a good laugh, cooled off and you kept him from duping someone else for at least a few minutes.

For those like you who enjoy playing the game without paying for it (in the case of phone reps selling advance fee resale packages) do a lot of good since these reps think you are buying every misleading statement they are throwing your way and have visions of a 35% commission coming their way only to find out this isn't to be. Now that's the ultimate way to get these companies since their reps time is tied up without getting the money for it.

As MasterCard says "Priceless".

This is too funny. They also tell the prospective client that they can get an exhorbitant price for their timeshare (that nobody would even consider paying on the resale market but the prospective client doesn't know any better). This exhorbitant price quote is the way upfront fee companies get their hook in.

And what is this all about? 999 = $11 a day for 90 days of advertisement 899 = $10 a day for 90 days of advertisement 799 = $9 a day for 90 days of advertisement 699 = $8 a day for 90 days of advertisement 599 = $ 7 a day for 90 days of advertisement 499 = $6 a day for 90 days of advertisement 399 = $5 a day for 90 days of advertisement

Edited to add ... never mind, I get it. It's the old bait and switch routine. If one quote doesn't reel in the client, they move onto the next quote ...... shades of developer salespeople. They play the same trick!

garym172 wrote:

The following is the pricing chart that CHL Marketing, Inc. (Timesharemls.org, TimeshareFSBO.com, Timeshare ResalesUSA.com and soon to be Timeshare Resales GMAC.com) uses.

So now their using GMAC (General Motors Acceptance Corporation) in their web address? Surely GMAC doesn't do business with these scammers? Perhaps the real GMAC should be notified of this new web address.

jayjay wrote:

garym172 wrote:

The following is the pricing chart that CHL Marketing, Inc. (Timesharemls.org, TimeshareFSBO.com, Timeshare ResalesUSA.com and soon to be Timeshare Resales GMAC.com) uses.

So now their using GMAC (General Motors Acceptance Corporation) in their web address? Surely GMAC doesn't do business with these scammers? Perhaps the real GMAC should be notified of this new web address.

The timeshareresalesgmac.com isn't an active site yet. I was informed by someone who has a contact inside their company that they would be starting a new website by the end of the year. All they could tell me was that the new site would contain some variation of resales and gmac.

I did a little research and found that timeshareresalesgmac.com was registered several years ago by the wife of the guy who owns CHL Marketing, Inc. and the various websites they market their resale package under. Although they haven't gone live with it yet it seems this is the most likely candidate to be the next web address.

The owner's wife is also a licensed real estate broker with gmac. They have done a pretty good job of keeping her real estate office separate from the advance fee resale entity portion. I know her office handles timeshares but I don't know if they try for any upfront fees or not. With her being a licensed agent it probably wouldn't be wise for them to try and charge upfront fees since this isn't legal to do unless they have found some way around it.

From what I understand some of the advance fee resale companies a few years ago would open a real estate office with a Century 21 affiliation then would use this affiliation in their selling pitches to add credibility. Although the real estate office was separate from the advance fee resale office they were able to claim a century 21 affiliation. When more and more people started complaining to Century 21 that companies stating they had affiliations with C21 were selling them worthless resale packages then C21 started ending their relationships with the resale companies.

GMAC is now the new real estate company some of these resale companies are associating with. Apparently when a person calls GMAC to complain about getting ripped off by a resale company using the GMAC connection for credibility these complaints fall on deaf ears. It seems the officers of the company are unreachable by phone, fax, mail or email. The money they generate from the resale companies must be very good and out weighs some complaints. However, as has been mentioned many times on Redweek, if they get enough complaints sooner or later they'll have to listen.

jayjay This is too funny. They also tell the prospective client that they can get an exhorbitant price for their timeshare (that nobody would even consider paying on the resale market but the prospective client doesn't know any better). This exhorbitant price quote is the way upfront fee companies get their hook in.

That's right JayJay and that's also the catch 22 in one part of their money back guarantee. They always state, we will refund your entire purchase price that you paid for our services should you sell your timeshare through any other source---and here's the catch---as long as you sell it for the same price or higher that you initially listed it with us for.

So they have a timeshare owner pumped that they're going to make a profit on their timeshare and they list it for much more than it's actually capable of being sold for. Now the resale company knows the timeshare owner will never actually sell the timeshare as a result of being on their website so should the timeshare owner sell the unit on their own it's going to be for a substantially less amount than listed on the resale site and thus the resale company doesn't have to worry about paying out a refund.

The company sure does know a money back guarantee sounds good though.

garym172

jayjay wrote:

This is too funny. They also tell the prospective client that they can get an exhorbitant price for their timeshare (that nobody would even consider paying on the resale market but the prospective client doesn't know any better). This exhorbitant price quote is the way upfront fee companies get their hook in.

That's right JayJay and that's also the catch 22 in one part of their money back guarantee. They always state, we will refund your entire purchase price that you paid for our services should you sell your timeshare through any other source---and here's the catch---as long as you sell it for the same price or higher that you initially listed it with us for.

So they have a timeshare owner pumped that they're going to make a profit on their timeshare and they list it for much more than it's actually capable of being sold for. Now the resale company knows the timeshare owner will never actually sell the timeshare as a result of being on their website so should the timeshare owner sell the unit on their own it's going to be for a substantially less amount than listed on the resale site and thus the resale company doesn't have to worry about paying out a refund.

The company sure does know a money back guarantee sounds good though.

======== I recently had a telemarketer call me to invite me to visit a TS. I let her tell me all about the wonders of the resort, then I told her I wasn't interested. She actually got mad and started yelling at me about wasting HER time. I loved every minute of it.

mike1536 wrote:

======== I recently had a telemarketer call me to invite me to visit a TS. I let her tell me all about the wonders of the resort, then I told her I wasn't interested. She actually got mad and started yelling at me about wasting HER time. I loved every minute of it.

Also too funny :o). That's what we should all do.

mike1536 garym172

jayjay wrote:

This is too funny. They also tell the prospective client that they can get an exhorbitant price for their timeshare (that nobody would even consider paying on the resale market but the prospective client doesn't know any better). This exhorbitant price quote is the way upfront fee companies get their hook in.

======== I recently had a telemarketer call me to invite me to visit a TS. I let her tell me all about the wonders of the resort, then I told her I wasn't interested. She actually got mad and started yelling at me about wasting HER time. I loved every minute of it.

Imagine that Mike, a telemarketer who thinks her time is more valuable than hers--no wonder she has an attitude problem. Great job in wasting her ever so valuable time and as a bonus you had fun doing it!

jayjay wrote:

mike1536 wrote:

======== I recently had a telemarketer call me to invite me to visit a TS. I let her tell me all about the wonders of the resort, then I told her I wasn't interested. She actually got mad and started yelling at me about wasting HER time. I loved every minute of it.

Also too funny :o). That's what we should all do.

I went to a sales presentation about 2 months ago. Told them I already own and where? he asked why I was interested in the presenation? I told him I wanted the free gifts? (airline tickets and two nights). He wasn't mad but basically told me I already had top of the line and gave me my gifts and let me go!!!

garym172 wrote:

jayjay wrote:

garym172 wrote:

The following is the pricing chart that CHL Marketing, Inc. (Timesharemls.org, TimeshareFSBO.com, Timeshare ResalesUSA.com and soon to be Timeshare Resales GMAC.com) uses.

So now their using GMAC (General Motors Acceptance Corporation) in their web address? Surely GMAC doesn't do business with these scammers? Perhaps the real GMAC should be notified of this new web address.

The timeshareresalesgmac.com isn't an active site yet. I was informed by someone who has a contact inside their company that they would be starting a new website by the end of the year. All they could tell me was that the new site would contain some variation of resales and gmac.

I did a little research and found that timeshareresalesgmac.com was registered several years ago by the wife of the guy who owns CHL Marketing, Inc. and the various websites they market their resale package under. Although they haven't gone live with it yet it seems this is the most likely candidate to be the next web address.

The owner's wife is also a licensed real estate broker with gmac. They have done a pretty good job of keeping her real estate office separate from the advance fee resale entity portion. I know her office handles timeshares but I don't know if they try for any upfront fees or not. With her being a licensed agent it probably wouldn't be wise for them to try and charge upfront fees since this isn't legal to do unless they have found some way around it.

From what I understand some of the advance fee resale companies a few years ago would open a real estate office with a Century 21 affiliation then would use this affiliation in their selling pitches to add credibility. Although the real estate office was separate from the advance fee resale office they were able to claim a century 21 affiliation. When more and more people started complaining to Century 21 that companies stating they had affiliations with C21 were selling them worthless resale packages then C21 started ending their relationships with the resale companies.

GMAC is now the new real estate company some of these resale companies are associating with. Apparently when a person calls GMAC to complain about getting ripped off by a resale company using the GMAC connection for credibility these complaints fall on deaf ears. It seems the officers of the company are unreachable by phone, fax, mail or email. The money they generate from the resale companies must be very good and out weighs some complaints. However, as has been mentioned many times on Redweek, if they get enough complaints sooner or later they'll have to listen.

Hey Gary,

A few months ago I received a dvd rom "infomercial" from Timeshare Resales U.S.A. Inc. / GMAC Real Estate, Orlando. I wonder if that's someone you know... It makes a good coaster for cold drinks except for the hole in the middle...

Here's a new one! I received 4 calls (3 were voice mails) from this gal repping Vacation Property Services in St. Pete.

She only wants $299 to list as rent to own - until it sells. Of course that wouldn't take long as she has high demand for Vistana Cascades Section ;-)

She claimed they average 40K resale transactions per year with less than 60 unresolved complaints. The BBB site listed 50 complaints in 36 months.

She gave me the St. Pete Chamber of Commerce phone number and their account number to verify membership and reputation... I'm half curious about that one, the local chamber is in on this stuff?

Hey Bruce,

I've never met her but Timeshare Resales USA/GMAC Real Estate Orlando in owned by the wife of the guy that owns CHL Marketing, Inc. and the websites--timesharemls.org and timesharefsbo.com.

I didn't think the business had any value at all but I am wrong since they did provide you with a shiny drink coaster.

bruce727 wrote:

A few months ago I received a dvd rom "infomercial" from Timeshare Resales U.S.A. Inc. / GMAC Real Estate, Orlando. I wonder if that's someone you know... It makes a good coaster for cold drinks except for the hole in the middle...

Here's a new one! I received 4 calls (3 were voice mails) from this gal repping Vacation Property Services in St. Pete.

She only wants $299 to list as rent to own - until it sells. Of course that wouldn't take long as she has high demand for Vistana Cascades Section ;-)

She claimed they average 40K resale transactions per year with less than 60 unresolved complaints. The BBB site listed 50 complaints in 36 months.

She gave me the St. Pete Chamber of Commerce phone number and their account number to verify membership and reputation... I'm half curious about that one, the local chamber is in on this stuff?

I'd be leery of the BBB in Florida as far as any timeshare related issue goes. There has to be thousands of complaints against all upfront fee companies in that state that's evidently being ignored by the BBB.

Timesharing is BIG BUSINESS in Florida and the BBB evidently doesn't want to rock the boat of that very lucrative and taxed based industry that brings thousands of people (and their money) to that state each year.

I also wouldn't depend on the Chamber of Commerce's input. They are in the same boat as the BBB. It seems all government entities in Florida shelter the timeshare industry.

Until there's a federal agency that steps in and regulates (I hate that word in most cases, but not in this case) the timeshare industry, the scammers will continue their scams.

BTW, how did these people get your phone number? I would never list my phone number in an ad on the internet. Scammers and advertisers phish the internet for phone numbers for their scams. I would list my email address only, and even then I would list a secondary email address, not my main email address.

I tell you what, if you give me $299 I will list your timeshare in a database on my computer that nobody will see, and even if they did see your timeshare and may be interested they wouldn't pay what I would tell you your timeshare is worth (very inflated) on the resale market. This is how upfront fee companies work.

Anyway, that would be an easy $299 to me for doing nothing but taking your credit card numher.